Drop Stealing

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daedroth
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby daedroth » Sat Apr 01, 2017 2:30 am

JadeFalcon wrote:And now, for something completely different.

Two rules:
- After the Crimson Dragon dies, the square in it is "locked" for 30 or more seconds. No one can enter it, or leave it.
- The Crimson item ALWAYS drops from inventory
Meaning that if someone did drop steal, he would still have to fight the other people on the square to get out.
This should be easy for NH to implement.

For example, in the situation of 10 Defiance and 1 Silh fighting the Dragon:
- Defiance makes lots of damage, but either the Silh guy gets the KS, or outright dropsteals the item
- The 10 Defiance now have the option to murder the Silh guy. The Silh guy cannot flee. He also cannot get help. If he D/C, he will still die.

I think this is a very simple mechanic that stops:
- "unfair" dropstealing by someone that just macro's stuff and runs away
- "lucky" shots, where you arrive and take the last shot, and think stuff is yours: Well, if you are alone, it is. If you aren't.. have a "discussion" with the rest of the folks with you, at the square


Edit: "he will still die"


I like this too.

Also if crafting did come about you would defnietly need some kind of container exclusively for crafting items. Could make it a buyable and that you could still store crafting stuff in your vault until you bought it.
Disclaimer: Any ideas I come up with may not even meet my approval. I am just posting an idea based on the topic I have just read.
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Rodeo
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby Rodeo » Sat Apr 01, 2017 1:11 pm

Crafting could easily be done via our auto quest system we have now examples are shard necklace and the new ring quest. You wouldn't need a container or anything special since the actual quest giver keeps up with whatever you give him. That seems simple enough.

When you finish the quest you get to choose from X amount of items.

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Miach
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby Miach » Sat Apr 01, 2017 3:44 pm

Rodeo wrote:Crafting could easily be done via our auto quest system we have now examples are shard necklace and the new ring quest. You wouldn't need a container or anything special since the actual quest giver keeps up with whatever you give him. That seems simple enough.

When you finish the quest you get to choose from X amount of items.


Didn't think about that, but yes, I like.

To clarify, this doesn't REPLACE things like the Crimson Dragon, it doesn't put a stop to Drop Stealing, it gives a new way to reward hard-working players who don't have the time or ability to party with lots of people due to any number of reasons.

It is definitely curved away from a Drop Stealing conversation.

Rodeo
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby Rodeo » Sat Apr 01, 2017 4:33 pm

I like the way this thread has evolved. Proud of you guys.

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NiteHawk
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby NiteHawk » Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:37 am

Crafting doesn't need the AQ system. I mean, we already do crafting with scripts, it's the same thing, just change blank scrolls with scales, and the actual scroll created with an item created.

I disagree with 'Dragon Scales' as a general thing. Crimson Dragon should drop Crimson Scales. All the weapons do something differently. Dragon Scales however COULD be a general drop that is needed for all the items and all dragons drop it, and then crimson scales could be the additional add but I don't really think that's needed. I'd rather just have more crimson scales drop for grabbing.

I don't know how I feel about the locking room. I 'can' do this, but is it the best option? You shift the drop stealing from a thief who was sitting there now to who the largest guild is in the room currently. I think it's better BUT I again see issues with it. Yes Folder, there is always going to be a big clan in all situations but we don't need to cator to them if we can avoid it. They already get bonuses by being large in events and other things.

IF we do go the locking root, part of me feels that locking the room completely is a bad lore idea. Instead, the item should bind the player to the ground for 30 seconds, lets say as he/she works on picking it up and it's heavy or that a special force surrounds them as they get it. I don't really know, but it would be that only the player getting the item is bound. They can still fight/heal though. I only wanna prevent movement, not full para.

This means that you'd actively have to hold the item for 30 seconds to obtain it. So if someone drops it, another has to attempt to pick it up and deal with the 30 second bind. Obviously when you are binded, party moving won't work. This ain't ROK right. The negative with this however is if you drop it and pick it up elsewhere it will bind you for 30 seconds as its a general script and I can't really do flags on items like that. However, I can ensure that if you drop it in a safe area like a city that isn't imposed. I don't see people dropping the scales on the floor anyways, that would probably be stupid.

So to sum up what I'm thinking via what everyone has been talking about for a mix/match system.

World Walker/World Walker Drop Changes
1. Scales would drop instead, more then one. Makes a market.
2. Picking up a scale in a unsafe area will bind you to the room for 30 seconds.
3. Multiple scales are needed to make an item.
4. Instead of having a boss that takes 2 months to kill, it can be more like 1-2 weeks. Because we use scales now, it could take a 2-4 crimson kills to actually make one item. AKA we can balance the items via its HP and amount of scales needed. Obviously these items should be tougher to obtain so we need a time to earn one item. I think it needs to be high as these items are generally 'radiant oads with teeth'. We don't need to reduce the time though, but people might attack it more and it might become more competitive if they see the HP dropping more often then not. What is a good time?


I think we can avoid the weird names and keep them general if we have the bind in a room for 30 seconds bit.


Here is a drop stealing mechanic for general items I want to do, how would people feel about this:
Right now to get an item it unhides you. This is a step in the right direction but maybe we need to be more harsh. How about you should have to unhide first to get an item, which would mean you are doing two actions, which is a delay. Is that a good idea on top to help with drop stealing in general (because obviously in other areas we won't do this dragon scale thing everywhere, would be annoying.)

I think this also makes it so a player cannot spam, they have to TIME their drop steal for when its about to die. They cannot simply unhide randomly so they cannot just spam a get key. It is actually a simple solution to the current mechanic. Obviously you can unhide by talking, but also I will make a simple /unhide command. I feel like this way it is at LEAST on pair with someone killing it. As they have two actions as well and often will not be spamming the get key, though if someone unhidden is, it's to their benefit as they are UNHIDDEN anyways and everyone is aware that they are there.

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daedroth
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby daedroth » Tue Apr 04, 2017 3:05 am

NiteHawk wrote:
Walkers Stuff:
... Instead, the item should bind the player to the ground for 30 seconds ...

Drop Stealing:
... How about you should have to unhide first to get an item, which would mean you are doing two actions...


Both of those ideas sound good.
Remember the Fade spell though (with regards to the drop stealing).
Disclaimer: Any ideas I come up with may not even meet my approval. I am just posting an idea based on the topic I have just read.
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Miach
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby Miach » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:35 pm

NiteHawk wrote:Crafting doesn't need the AQ system. I mean, we already do crafting with scripts, it's the same thing, just change blank scrolls with scales, and the actual scroll created with an item created.

I disagree with 'Dragon Scales' as a general thing. Crimson Dragon should drop Crimson Scales. All the weapons do something differently. Dragon Scales however COULD be a general drop that is needed for all the items and all dragons drop it, and then crimson scales could be the additional add but I don't really think that's needed. I'd rather just have more crimson scales drop for grabbing.

I don't know how I feel about the locking room. I 'can' do this, but is it the best option? You shift the drop stealing from a thief who was sitting there now to who the largest guild is in the room currently. I think it's better BUT I again see issues with it. Yes Folder, there is always going to be a big clan in all situations but we don't need to cator to them if we can avoid it. They already get bonuses by being large in events and other things.

IF we do go the locking root, part of me feels that locking the room completely is a bad lore idea. Instead, the item should bind the player to the ground for 30 seconds, lets say as he/she works on picking it up and it's heavy or that a special force surrounds them as they get it. I don't really know, but it would be that only the player getting the item is bound. They can still fight/heal though. I only wanna prevent movement, not full para.

This means that you'd actively have to hold the item for 30 seconds to obtain it. So if someone drops it, another has to attempt to pick it up and deal with the 30 second bind. Obviously when you are binded, party moving won't work. This ain't ROK right. The negative with this however is if you drop it and pick it up elsewhere it will bind you for 30 seconds as its a general script and I can't really do flags on items like that. However, I can ensure that if you drop it in a safe area like a city that isn't imposed. I don't see people dropping the scales on the floor anyways, that would probably be stupid.

So to sum up what I'm thinking via what everyone has been talking about for a mix/match system.

World Walker/World Walker Drop Changes
1. Scales would drop instead, more then one. Makes a market.
2. Picking up a scale in a unsafe area will bind you to the room for 30 seconds.
3. Multiple scales are needed to make an item.
4. Instead of having a boss that takes 2 months to kill, it can be more like 1-2 weeks. Because we use scales now, it could take a 2-4 crimson kills to actually make one item. AKA we can balance the items via its HP and amount of scales needed. Obviously these items should be tougher to obtain so we need a time to earn one item. I think it needs to be high as these items are generally 'radiant oads with teeth'. We don't need to reduce the time though, but people might attack it more and it might become more competitive if they see the HP dropping more often then not. What is a good time?


I think we can avoid the weird names and keep them general if we have the bind in a room for 30 seconds bit.


Here is a drop stealing mechanic for general items I want to do, how would people feel about this:
Right now to get an item it unhides you. This is a step in the right direction but maybe we need to be more harsh. How about you should have to unhide first to get an item, which would mean you are doing two actions, which is a delay. Is that a good idea on top to help with drop stealing in general (because obviously in other areas we won't do this dragon scale thing everywhere, would be annoying.)

I think this also makes it so a player cannot spam, they have to TIME their drop steal for when its about to die. They cannot simply unhide randomly so they cannot just spam a get key. It is actually a simple solution to the current mechanic. Obviously you can unhide by talking, but also I will make a simple /unhide command. I feel like this way it is at LEAST on pair with someone killing it. As they have two actions as well and often will not be spamming the get key, though if someone unhidden is, it's to their benefit as they are UNHIDDEN anyways and everyone is aware that they are there.


How about Thieves/Brigs get a reduction in the bind or immune to it completely, since they lack fighting capabilities for the most part.

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NiteHawk
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby NiteHawk » Wed Apr 05, 2017 4:07 am

Having them immune to it completely makes the system completely worthless. The people who 'are' drop stealing are assassins and thieves.

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Mujahideen
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby Mujahideen » Wed Apr 05, 2017 5:01 am

Give them longer death exh.
Troll. I am here to create the issues that plague the game, I will push your buttons and like the outcome.

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JadeFalcon
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Re: Drop Stealing

Postby JadeFalcon » Wed Apr 05, 2017 5:15 am

Mujahideen wrote:Give them longer death exh.


I totally agree with this - but for all 25ers.
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